Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
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Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
@LorenzoC
Everyone is speaking about the survey because it's used to justify the default opt-in to "acceptable ads".
Everyone is speaking about the survey because it's used to justify the default opt-in to "acceptable ads".
Latvian List maintainer
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
Oh wow... So somehow he's convinced there's a "silent majority" that totally supports him backstabbing his users by sneaking in a whitelist of advertisers who paid him enough? And that anyone who disagrees with him selling out like this is just here to complain and rant and should be ignored!?anonymous74100 wrote:I find it strange that so many people take the survey seriously, there no proof that the results are not faked. Wladimir posts pictures in his blog that perfectly align with his goals and no one is questioning the authenticity? Stop citing the survey results like it is some kind of a fact.
It's quite obvious that Wladimir won't change his mind, just look at his latest blog post. You can't reason with delusional people who think they are doing the right thing.
Yeah I guess I just lost all hope I still had for the project... Can't wait for a better ad blocker!
It's quite funny now to read Wladimir's blog post from 2009 complaining about NoScript's tricks to enable ads on their own page...
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
@anonymous74100:
Nope it is used to justify the very concept of "acceptable ads", the way it is implemented is another topic.
In short, it was said 75% of the 0.2% user base would happily see "some non-intrusive advertisement", then to make everybody happy (including the advertisers) we need to make sure ABP users see the said "non-intrusive advertisement".
The implementation is not meant to make everybody opt-out, it is aimed to give a chance to opt-out to the 25% of 0.2% who don't agree.
Nope it is used to justify the very concept of "acceptable ads", the way it is implemented is another topic.
In short, it was said 75% of the 0.2% user base would happily see "some non-intrusive advertisement", then to make everybody happy (including the advertisers) we need to make sure ABP users see the said "non-intrusive advertisement".
The implementation is not meant to make everybody opt-out, it is aimed to give a chance to opt-out to the 25% of 0.2% who don't agree.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
Did the poll define exactly what "acceptable" was when asking it? Because that remains a completely vague term that means something completely different to everybody (despite the now-published "definition"). Unless there was a solid definition when asked, and that solid definition followed through to this implemented plan, then there was no usable solid data collected.
He's converting us into his product to sell to advertisers in a method contrary to the software's purpose -- blocking ads. That requires a lot of explanation. That is the cost of wanting it both ways. It is a choice to sacrifice credibility in exchange for cash payments. Having it both ways without blowback was never going to happen.MonztA wrote:Why has Wladimir to explain himself?
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
@nowayout
I think you aren't grasping the origin of this discussion.
ABP alone is a machine that does nothing, it requires somebody to input "rules".
At some point to make it easy to use, it was made so it imports "rules" in form of subscription and then people just install it and forget.
Problem is the subscriptions cannot be tailored on everybody's likes and dislikes, so they remove ANYTHING.
At some point Wladimir though he had unleashed the "end of the world machine" over the Internet and now he is trying to put it under control by adding a sort of "anti-subscription-subscription". The "educate the advertisers" is a nice idea but IMHO it stands at the side of what I have written above.
Of course you wonder why Wladimir has not made the "anti-subscription-subscription" available so who ever wants to support advertisers can just pick it.
It is because most people want to install ABP without any question asked, so they aren't going to look for the "anti-subscription-subscription".
And this explains why it is enabled by default and "hidden" as checkbox (in case the mindless user thinks "what is this subscription I haven't selected, lets delete it).
Long ago I suggested Wladimir to separate ABP in two software, one completely automated for people who just want some advertisement removed and one with the current tools for writing "custom filters" aimed to those users like me who want to decide what to filter out and what not. If I remember it correctly he said my proposal made no sense given the work necessary to split the project in two and to maintain it, plus it would be good only for a small number of people.
I think you aren't grasping the origin of this discussion.
ABP alone is a machine that does nothing, it requires somebody to input "rules".
At some point to make it easy to use, it was made so it imports "rules" in form of subscription and then people just install it and forget.
Problem is the subscriptions cannot be tailored on everybody's likes and dislikes, so they remove ANYTHING.
At some point Wladimir though he had unleashed the "end of the world machine" over the Internet and now he is trying to put it under control by adding a sort of "anti-subscription-subscription". The "educate the advertisers" is a nice idea but IMHO it stands at the side of what I have written above.
Of course you wonder why Wladimir has not made the "anti-subscription-subscription" available so who ever wants to support advertisers can just pick it.
It is because most people want to install ABP without any question asked, so they aren't going to look for the "anti-subscription-subscription".
And this explains why it is enabled by default and "hidden" as checkbox (in case the mindless user thinks "what is this subscription I haven't selected, lets delete it).
Long ago I suggested Wladimir to separate ABP in two software, one completely automated for people who just want some advertisement removed and one with the current tools for writing "custom filters" aimed to those users like me who want to decide what to filter out and what not. If I remember it correctly he said my proposal made no sense given the work necessary to split the project in two and to maintain it, plus it would be good only for a small number of people.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
It sounds like the real issue here is that users want to support some sites they like, and would be happy to view ads to do so. Adblock Plus provides a way for those users to view the ads BUT users are lazy and aren't finding/hitting the button.
So the solution was to select some (let's face it, one) advertiser and let their ads through. Always.
That just seems ludicrous to me. Users want to support the sites, not the advertisers. The solution is to make it easier/help users opt into ads on sites that they want to see support. Firefox provides boatloads of data about what sites people visit frequently and like. Why not work on a UI that prompted or helped them enable ads on those sites?
So the solution was to select some (let's face it, one) advertiser and let their ads through. Always.
That just seems ludicrous to me. Users want to support the sites, not the advertisers. The solution is to make it easier/help users opt into ads on sites that they want to see support. Firefox provides boatloads of data about what sites people visit frequently and like. Why not work on a UI that prompted or helped them enable ads on those sites?
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
Because if you prompt people with ANYTHING they just switch off whatever software is bugging them, without even paying attention to the message.
Besides, you cannot make ABP even more annoying than the advertisement it is aimed to remove.
Besides, you cannot make ABP even more annoying than the advertisement it is aimed to remove.
- EnviroChem
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Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
I agree that Google controls too much and it is quite scary. They have successfully cornered the Internet search and advertising markets. This is the biggest reason I don't believe users should use Google Chrome, it just allows Google to gain a stronger control over the Internet. Right now, if I want to succeed as a web publisher, I must bow down to Google's every whim. I believe they have become too powerful of a monopoly, but there isn't much I can do about this. Only government regulators can step in and change things.Guest wrote:AdSense has a different problem; it's Google. Google is too pervasive. IMO, users cannot trust Google for both tools (search, maps), adverts and voice. Only one of these.
I trust them only for the first of these. From a user perspective, Google as a 3rd party ad service is also problematic because it's difficult to block at all. If you use any Google services, whether through google.com or embedded in 3rd party websites, you have to open your browser to them.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
Like most of the people writing here, you mean? This is more than a dislike of adverts, it's almost like religion with you guys.anonymous74100 wrote:.. just look at his latest blog post. You can't reason with delusional people who think they are doing the right thing.
I didn't think I liked seeing ads much, but you guys are a bunch of parasitic crazies! Use something else, because that's all you guys can ever do - use. You never give anything to the world.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
To whitelistning SEDO is not "acceptable".
Maybe Wladimir is not so clever that he thought starting with "acceptable ads in Adblock Plus" with ads from this Domain-Grabbing-Parasite.
Maybe Wladimir is not so clever that he thought starting with "acceptable ads in Adblock Plus" with ads from this Domain-Grabbing-Parasite.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
I am trying to figure this out.
So adblock can only block certain ads?
So adblock can only block certain ads?
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
@Juanisan:
Nope, Adblock Plus does exactly the same things as before.
You just have a pre-installed list of "allowed advertisement" and if you don't like it, you can un-select the proper checkbox in the "subscriptions" panel.
It is not the end of the world.
Nope, Adblock Plus does exactly the same things as before.
You just have a pre-installed list of "allowed advertisement" and if you don't like it, you can un-select the proper checkbox in the "subscriptions" panel.
It is not the end of the world.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
Well, it blocks around 99.8% of the ads you'd ever see on the Net. The only ones it's going to allow (you check a box to opt out of this) are the ads of some domain squatting company - you know when a site no longer exists and instead you get a page of 'related' ads?Juanisan wrote:I am trying to figure this out.
So adblock can only block certain ads?
Yeah, so all this talk of trust, betrayal and backstabbing is based on not being able to check one box and get on with their lives. Empty rhetoric I reckon.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
@Pete:
The fact that ABP now partners with advertisers is not the end of the world.
That doesn't mean automatically it is also a good thing and we should party.
I ask you a simple question from the advertiser point of view:
It seems in the next future ABP will block ANY advertisement in the range of its subscriptions (as before) BUT those coming from the advertisers who are ABP partners (this is new).
So either all existing advertisers are going to submit a request of partnership and ABP includes them all in the whitelist, or some (most?) will be blocked, REGARDLESS if they are "acceptable" or not. Plus, if a site you want to support through advertisement is sponsored by one of those advertisers who aren't included, the whitelist does not make you any good and the advertisement is blocked (until you manually make exceptions, as before). Do you think this makes sense or it is just empty rhetoric?
Considering things from the user's point of view is rather pointless until you don't also consider that there are different kind of users.
Those who consider their PC (or mobile devices) like a mysterious magic box won't mind of anything, while others can be more picky.
The fact that ABP now partners with advertisers is not the end of the world.
That doesn't mean automatically it is also a good thing and we should party.
I ask you a simple question from the advertiser point of view:
It seems in the next future ABP will block ANY advertisement in the range of its subscriptions (as before) BUT those coming from the advertisers who are ABP partners (this is new).
So either all existing advertisers are going to submit a request of partnership and ABP includes them all in the whitelist, or some (most?) will be blocked, REGARDLESS if they are "acceptable" or not. Plus, if a site you want to support through advertisement is sponsored by one of those advertisers who aren't included, the whitelist does not make you any good and the advertisement is blocked (until you manually make exceptions, as before). Do you think this makes sense or it is just empty rhetoric?
Considering things from the user's point of view is rather pointless until you don't also consider that there are different kind of users.
Those who consider their PC (or mobile devices) like a mysterious magic box won't mind of anything, while others can be more picky.
Re: Allowing acceptable ads in Adblock Plus
I once saw a website that did have acceptable ads it was very simple
If you hovered your cursor over a piece of text or picture a definition of the word would pop up.
If you double clicked on a piece of text or picture an advert would appear of a place where to purchase or find out more about the word you just double clicked on.
This was non intrusive and to me was very good.
These are the only kinds of advertising I consider acceptable. Any other kind, just adds more to the amount you download by viewing a web page.
If you hovered your cursor over a piece of text or picture a definition of the word would pop up.
If you double clicked on a piece of text or picture an advert would appear of a place where to purchase or find out more about the word you just double clicked on.
This was non intrusive and to me was very good.
These are the only kinds of advertising I consider acceptable. Any other kind, just adds more to the amount you download by viewing a web page.